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Victoria Mindova

The Director of the New Acropolis Museum Prof. Dimitrios Pandermalis speaks exclusively to GRReporter about the world historical heritage of the ancient Greek culture and the new methods of study of ancient remains. He stressed that archeology is an inspiring, but also a demanding profession. As director of one of the most beautiful museums in the world, Pandermalis stressed that the people visiting it come to feel good in it, learn new things, feel comfortable and realize that we are not living in the world only here and now, but we are part of eternity.

The problem with ancient marble artifacts at the British Museum has been on the agenda for many years and Greece has repeatedly tried to bring them back home. Tell us more about this problem and your position as the director of the New Acropolis Museum.

The Parthenon marbles issue has two sides. The first concerns the museum and the second relates generally to the state and the Ministry of Culture, which should take a general decision on the issue of bringing the missing parts back to Greece. The museum could only deal with the specific issues related to the exhibits. Currently, the museum owns half of the bas-reliefs and our main task was to answer the question of "How to present the exhibits to the public?"

From the outset, we decided that we wanted to show the people all the Parthenon had. The only way to do this was to expose all original pieces and to our great regret, to supplement the missing pieces with replicas made primarily from gypsum.

Did you make the difference between the originals and the copies visible on purpose?

Of course not. Just the copy can not have the same quality and appearance as the original. Otherwise, it is as if we are trying to lie to the visitors. On the other hand, this enables us to show how rich and beautiful was the Parthenon, how many and different sculptures it had. The visitors have the opportunity to see the combination and feel the atmosphere. If there were no replicas of the missing pieces, there would be some pieces here and there, and the works would not have its full appearance. When we arranged the initial exhibition at the museum, our work was not completed. We continue to explore the exhibits and reevaluate some data. We do not live believing that there is no need of change or improvement since the museum opened its doors.

What steps did you take to develop or even improve the exhibition?

After we arranged the exhibits, we started looking and examining additional pieces and remains at the museum repository. We found that the replicas presented so far are really good, but they do not meet the level of the originals and have some defects from the scientific point of view. Therefore, we started two programs that will help us solve this problem. Their main goal is to find scientifically how to connect the various parts of the exhibits when the time comes. In the autumn, we will start a three-dimensional study of the pieces using new technologies. It will give us an accurate digital picture of exhibits from all sides to determine how the different pieces were removed from the Parthenon. We will apply this method to all the exhibits at our museum and to those at the British Museum. Then, we will make a digital connection, which will be highly accurate and will show clearly whether there is a need for further development or not.

You understand that the authentic marble parts can not be compared with the replicas. The gypsum from which they are made is inexpensive and fragile material that is easily deformed. Furthermore, not all the originals and their surfaces are fully explored. Only the visible surface has been studied until recently but the back of the bas-relief also has a history. The study will be conducted in cooperation with our British colleagues. They have nothing against the project because it is scientific work and it is actually more important to us. This will make it clear how the various objects have been separated from the original structure. Some of them had broken due to vibrations of the bombings; others because of corrosion and the effect of time, third were deliberately broken or cut. Understanding the process by which they were separated and the Parthenon was destroyed will help us put the pieces together again. This is our program on the issue of the missing pieces of marble for the coming years. As for bringing back the marbles from the British Museum, you should contact the Ministry of Culture.
 
Could we expect the New Acropolis Museum to house the remains, which are now in the possession of the British Museum, as a guest exhibition? Are you discussing this issue with your British colleagues?

All options are open, but this particular issue is beyond my responsibilities. If necessary, I would take part in the negotiations. As happened during the talks UNESCO organized a month ago when it was decided on the programs I told you about. This is an important development, because it is one thing to say, "Bring back the marble" and quite different to establish with scientific accuracy where each missing piece was taken from and where it belongs. You should not think that the British Museum knows where each piece was taken from and what it symbolizes.

The exhibits at the British Museum are not only exhibits of ancient Greek history, but also from Egypt and many others. I understand the importance of the idea of bringing the taken pieces back home, but I would like to ask you is it not a good advertisement if the Greek culture is presented to the public at the British Museum?

This is a good question. There are many pieces of antiquity at the British Museum and some of them could be exhibited there indeed. The most important thing, however, is to return the bas-reliefs and the pieces from the Parthenon because it is a historical monument that has suffered much over the centuries. It has survived not only natural destruction, but also fires, bomb damage in the days of Morosini during the 17th century, robbery, embezzlement by Lord Elgin in the 18th century and so on. Given that these parts of the temple are available, it would be better to place them where they belong.

You mentioned UNESCO earlier in our conversation and I would like to ask you if there are any new arrangements for the protection of historical monuments and precisely for limiting the black marketing of antiques?

There are constant discussions at UNESCO on all these issues you mentioned and there is a constant dialogue about the problems associated with illicit trade in objects of historic and archaeological value. For example, last week Greece signed with the USA an agreement for banning the free trade of these objects. They will be examined and if they do not have the necessary documents or a passport, certifying that they are lawfully acquired they should be confiscated.

On the day of the national holiday of Greece, there was free attendance to the New Acropolis Museum. The initiative was very successful and the queue of visitors began in the early morning and continued until the evening hours. Many people said they would prefer free entrance to the museum throughout the year. Do you consider something like that?

The board of the museum decided to pursue a specific policy and it includes an entrance ticket.

The museum is a state property. Is there no funding?

The state gave its permission to hold the proceeds from the sale of tickets in addition to the funding. At this point, however, the state is in a difficult position. Therefore, we tightened the belts and now we are covering the costs alone. In other words, we do not use public funding. If things get worse, however, we could require the Ministry of Culture to fund the museum. It is not easy, but we are still doing well. We are keeping the ticket price low so that the exhibits are available to greater numbers of visitors. People love the museum; they are binding with it, building a personal relationship with the place and the exhibits and returning again and again.

From your words, I understand that the crisis has reached the New Acropolis Museum.

How it should not reach it! It would be odd if the crisis, through which Greece is currently going, has not affected the museum. Strikes and protests block the centre of Athens often. This stops the flow of visitors. The same is true when the public transport was on strike and when there were different rallies in the centre. These are 10-20 thousand visitors less. But these are the problems of the country today. These phenomena will disappear and the crisis itself. We just have to be patient. We are doing well for now.

What could we expect from the museum? Are you planning further exhibitions in the near future, beside the permanent exhibitions?

The museum is still new and we continue to make changes to the permanent exhibition. Moreover, the excavations under the museum are going on. They are also part of the permanent exhibition, but are not finished yet. Briefly, we have to finish the things we have started first and then we will think about further exhibitions.

How does it feel to be the director and responsible for one of the finest museums in the world?

The feeling is very difficult to be explained. I could tell you that I started dealing with the museum issues about 11 years ago when the last competition was held. I went all the way to its opening. From the preparation through the licensing procedures, the transfer of the exhibits, the creation of the exhibition, its arrangement and its opening was the next stage of a very long road. I did not take this post when the museum was ready; I got it before it was real. Therefore, I could say that the New Acropolis Museum is an essential part of my life. Actually, it is the most mature period in my life that will be the end of my professional career. I made important excavations in northern Greece, I taught 35 years at the university. Now, the museum is my vocation.

What do you tell young archaeologists? What should they expect from this occupation?

I always tell the young students that archeology as a profession is very interesting to the public and to us as scientists, but it is not easy. There are serious problems – managerial and financial. However, you should be positive and ready to fight. You should always be open-minded and be ready to adapt to the changes and to seek new ways to present history to the public in an attractive way. This is what I have learned all the way to the opening of this museum. The historical treasures it presents are public wealth. It belongs not only to the archaeological world, but also to the public. It is not easy to make it accessible. When the people are visiting the museum, they should feel good in it, learn new things, feel calm and realize that we as humans are not living in the world only here and now, we are part of eternity.